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Post by papacheese on Nov 17, 2008 6:14:51 GMT -5
I feel your pain, TFK...whenever I'm "demonstrating" the vest to our members, it always looks like I'm having a wrestling match with myself trying to get the *&^#(@! on. One can only hope that they'll revise the regulation and maybe our PPE so we don't have one more thing to worry about...
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Bossa
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Post by Bossa on Nov 17, 2008 10:39:14 GMT -5
Weve been using them for about a month and yes they are a pain.
Dont worry though... Soon, someone will make a better vest that will be specific for the fire service and our gear! It will also cost 10 times more than your regular vest becaause it says Firefighter somewhere on it!!! ;D
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Post by breakingsomemirror on Nov 17, 2008 11:10:48 GMT -5
I agree with Papacheese completely. It all starts with the officers doing their job and leading by example. It's not always fun being an officer but nobody said it would be! It's a sore subject with me (officers not leading by example) and it's a good lesson for any new or aspiring officer. Whether it sucks or not, do the right thing and LEAD by example. Seriously, how can you expect your firefighters to do something if you won't don't it yourself? I still get busted on because when I was a DC, I always wore my turnouts. People thought I was crazy but I want to show my guys (and gals) that I wasn't above wearing my gear and that if I expected them to do it, then I should do it to. I know it's a bad habit of some chief officers not to but I always wanted to set the right tone. Same thing goes for the vests when I'm at work. For the guys just getting them, hang in there! I know it's a pain but you'll get used to it. I know it sounds obvious but try and get used to putting it on when you're not on a call. Never thought I'd ever advocate practicing putting a vest on during my career but learn from my mistakes. It helps! I also try and make sure that the vest is put away so that it's set to the largest setting possible, for big guys like me. That way I don't look like a circus bear fighting with a yellow pillow case on the side of the truck!  Vests are not the end all, cure all but I guess every little bit helps. We'll have to see. Stay safe everybody. |
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ENG27SQ
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Post by ENG27SQ on Nov 17, 2008 11:24:59 GMT -5
Weve been using them for about a month and yes they are a pain. It will also cost 10 times more than your regular vest becaause it says Firefighter somewhere on it!!! ;D That's very true. It'll be some dickhead who has already made millions in the fire service with simple things like this who will again, make out like a bandit. |
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Maverick27
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Post by Maverick27 on Dec 26, 2008 9:36:46 GMT -5
I too have had problems putting on the vest at the 2-7. They are a royal PITA to put on over gear, but eventually you get them on.
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Post by fireman1190 on Dec 26, 2008 18:31:13 GMT -5
i find that when i go to put one on they are twisted or the velcro connections arent right...
I agree that this is a pain. A simple solution might be to have each crew member inspect and properly store their vests in the truck so that it is ready for the next call.
This is common sense but we dont always think of it. To make sure we all do this will only take 10 seconds of our time after the call... and it will save time on the next call.
common sense, but just a thought.
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ENG27SQ
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Post by ENG27SQ on Dec 28, 2008 13:05:19 GMT -5
i find that when i go to put one on they are twisted or the velcro connections arent right... I agree that this is a pain. A simple solution might be to have each crew member inspect and properly store their vests in the truck so that it is ready for the next call. This is common sense but we dont always think of it. To make sure we all do this will only take 10 seconds of our time after the call... and it will save time on the next call. common sense, but just a thought. Just wait, someone will patent the idea to have them intergrated into our turnout coats...you just wait |
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Post by fireman1190 on Dec 28, 2008 17:25:38 GMT -5
or they'll dye our turnout gear lime green!
that kinda makes me cringe. ewww
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ENG27SQ
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Post by ENG27SQ on Dec 28, 2008 17:44:44 GMT -5
or they'll dye our turnout gear lime green! that kinda makes me cringe. ewww Wouldn't surprise me the least. Interesting enough but still...we had our vests on at a MVC last night, we were seen better without it due to it covering the PPEs reflective than we do with the vests on. Block the scene with the apparatus, it can be replaced, firemen cannot. |
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Post by Kramer on Dec 28, 2008 18:01:32 GMT -5
I was stuck in traffic for the cut on 295 yesterday and the 272 guys were extremely visible with the vests as opposed to the other hundred people on scene without them. it was a day time call but it was very overcast so it made a difference
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ENG27SQ
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Post by ENG27SQ on Dec 28, 2008 18:09:52 GMT -5
I was stuck in traffic for the cut on 295 yesterday and the 272 guys were extremely visible with the vests as opposed to the other hundred people on scene without them. it was a day time call but it was very overcast so it made a difference Of course, you have to take the weather conditions and sunlight into consideration. We were operating around 730ish on Route 70 with no light other than the light tower and post lights compared to sunlight. |
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Post by WebBoss on Dec 30, 2008 17:08:52 GMT -5
For everybody who has been chiming in on the "Countywide Department" conversations, I ask you to please read [glow=red,2,300]this topic [/glow]again.
Something as stupid as wearing a crappy little vest that might save your life on the side of the road should not drum up this much back and forth bs.
Wear your vest, weather you like it or not, it's the law. If you don't want to wear your vest, then you don't have to... just stay off the damn fire truck all together.
People wonder why we can't do anything to promote people working together under a common set of rules... THIS IS EXACTLY WHY! Because you guys have to bitch and moan about something as stupid as a traffic vest and a rule that not a single one of us have any authority to overturn or change right now.
If you're not putting your SCBA on, then put your damn vest on. It's just that simple.
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Post by fireman1190 on Dec 31, 2008 3:59:11 GMT -5
okay. I didnt come on this forum to bitch and moan. the traffic vests are not perfect, but i'm interested in proposing solutions. i proposed we make sure vests are in good order when the truck backs into the station after a call. its not much. but it helps solve the twisted vest problem.
i dont think someone like a webboss coming on here and writing an angry post to the rest of us is helpful at all. that doesnt help us solve problems either.
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ENG27SQ
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Post by ENG27SQ on Dec 31, 2008 14:01:18 GMT -5
For everybody who has been chiming in on the "Countywide Department" conversations, I ask you to please read [glow=red,2,300]this topic [/glow] again.Something as stupid as wearing a crappy little vest that might save your life on the side of the road should not drum up this much back and forth bs. Wear your vest, weather you like it or not, it's the law. If you don't want to wear your vest, then you don't have to... just stay off the damn fire truck all together. People wonder why we can't do anything to promote people working together under a common set of rules... THIS IS EXACTLY WHY! Because you guys have to bitch and moan about something as stupid as a traffic vest and a rule that not a single one of us have any authority to overturn or change right now. If you're not putting your SCBA on, then put your damn vest on. It's just that simple. It's the fact that they instituted this law, now we have to abide by it and not everybody likes it, well, this service is going to continue to change things for OUR OWN SAFETY, get used to it or like Sean stated above, stay off the apparatus.Now I won't sit here and praise these vests, I'm not up and giddy about them but it just might save your ass one day. You might just be walking around and someone just might swerve to miss you. Hell, if traffic actually slows down some drivers might even say "I didn't see you guys the other day on that accident on xx street but your vests stood you all out tonight." ^Something like that could happen and then it might not, who knows. But as long as everyone goes home we should all be happy. People will bitch,moan,groan and complain, in today's world, it is just how some are. In lieu of repeating myself, WEAR your vest unless that SCBA is on your back! Rant concluded |
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Post by papacheese on Jan 1, 2009 6:37:54 GMT -5
Beating the dead horse a little bit further, items and procedures like these vests have what I term "negative reinforcement", ie: unless you happen to get smacked by a car or truck, it's almost impossible to appreciate it's real value. The same could be said for anything even remotely termed "safe" or "smart".
A year or two ago I showed my troops a video from the Peoples Burn Foundation that documented the treatment cycle of several severely burned people, including a firefighter with the subliminal message: wear your gear. Being the cynic that I am, I assumed there would be the usual round of smart ass observations, comments and guffaws from the peanut gallery, but much to my surprise, you could have heard a pin drop in the room.
Being smart and being brave are not mutually exclusive virtues.
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Bossa
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Post by Bossa on Jan 8, 2009 12:45:11 GMT -5
I think the reason people are bitching and moaning was the lack of information leading up to it. Alot of items were vague regarding the fire service and the wearing of the vests. We started looking at what vests we wanted to buy back in May of 08, but it didnt make it any easier, especially finding sized to fit over some of our bigger guys and their turnout gear!
That being said, I wear my vest for all activities on roadways, with the exception of course of fire suppression activities. 4001 wears his all the time, on all calls, unless he puts a pack on! Thats setting a good example in my opinion and is an instant reminder to someone who may be getting off the truck without one!
Just remember, with these vests on, your not neccisarily safer from the motorist on the road. Its still up to you to be aware of everything around you and keep yourself and your brothers and sisters out of harms way on the highway!!!
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Post by thelurker on Jan 9, 2009 1:30:44 GMT -5
If your department is not looking at this from a safety standpoint, but rather a "rule compliance" stand point, here is a list of all roadways in NJ that are considered a "federal-aid roadway." Going by the rules, if you are not on one of these roadways or you don't have any of these roadways in your district, then you are not required to wear a safety vest by the new regulations. www.state.nj.us/transportation/refdata/roadway/pdf/NJ2004NHS_Routes.pdf |
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Post by papacheese on Jan 9, 2009 6:24:24 GMT -5
Lurker, you bring up a good point...if you read the rule, it IS specific as to application - federally funded roadways such as (in our case) Route 38. Technically, that's the only place we have to wear them to be truly compliant....yet it's not the only place we can get smacked by a vehicle.
Just to illustrate how cynical I'm becoming, my first thought when reading the rule was "OK, now the engine room lawyers will thumb their collective noses at the rule since Main Street (which is no less dangerous) isn't a "federally funded roadway"...to me, the best interpretation is that the rule applies to all roadway surfaces in which vehicular traffic is present. Overkill? Possibly...but it makes applying the rule a whole lot simpler. Can you get hit by a car in a busy strip store parking lot? Hell yes! Likely? No, but nevertheless a potential.
My opinion is: if you're NOT in SCBA and standing in or could be standing in the roadway, put it on. What does it hurt? Your pride?
One last thought: has anyone else noticed that the police are somewhat less than compliant, or is that just another Motown thing?
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1710
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Post by 1710 on Jan 9, 2009 7:27:50 GMT -5
The can not tell you the last time I saw a Trooper from Red Lion in a vest.
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Post by thelurker on Jan 9, 2009 10:28:31 GMT -5
our police won't wear them either. now if you read the rules, they don't have to wear them while engaged in the active enforcement of the law, i.e. traffic stops and foot chases, but should be wearing them during accident investigations and directing traffic. they applied for exemptions just like the fire service did.
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